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Post by elliott on Apr 9, 2018 16:45:27 GMT -5
Taking a page from Cap's book, I wanted to put this forward for discussion. Two of the most universally beloved matches ever. Both are WON MOTY winners and I suspect are matches many will consider for #1 overall.
What are other people's thoughts on these matches?
Where will they rank?
Which will rank higher?
What are the relative strengths and weaknesses of each?
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Post by jetlag on Apr 10, 2018 14:27:32 GMT -5
Both matches are insanely overrated, however Austin/Hart may be the better match, while Villano/Atlantis is the more epic moment. FWIW Villano III's performance smokes anything the WWF match had. I'm not sure either will make my Top 100 since I'm still hemming and hawing about what my actual criteria will be. Maybe V3/Atlantis because fucking hell that ending.
Watching Austin/Hart with Austin's commentary is quite the experience. Austin was right that he could have, should have done a better job drawing in the audience. On the other hand his idea for changing the finish was rubbish. They already crammed too much into what should've been a much simpler match. He could've done a far better job selling the leg. Austin looked worldclass selling the finish. Bret Hart is always such a workman without any frills it's nearly impossible to comment on him.
V3/Atlantis may have set the blueprint for every shitty modern apuestas match. They fumble around in the opening with Atlantis probably having the blood rush into his head cause the rudo fans all got on his case. Then there's that fucking spot of the decade contender and they go on and do 2,99999s and near submissions back and forth for 20 minutes. Not going to play that card but how would modern workers not get grilled over doing something like that?? Still, match had that awesome intensity throughout. V3's punch combos and resistance carried the match. He also saved the opening by firing up and ripping Atlantis open when the referee admonished him. I'm not sure the blood was better than Hart/Austin. V3 could probably carry Ultimo Guerrero to a really good apuestas match.
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Post by bossrock on Apr 10, 2018 16:24:07 GMT -5
Wrestlemania 13. Atlantis-Villano is great but I feel like it doesn't really get going until the blood starts flowing. Hart-Austin is pretty consistently great and urgent throughout.
Interestingly enough though I might not even consider either one of them as the best match of their respective years. I lean more towards Kobashi-Misawa 1/20 and Michaels-Taker HIAC for '97 and Misawa-Akiyama 2/27 for '00.
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Post by microstatistics on May 2, 2018 2:04:01 GMT -5
I'll go with Bret vs. Austin, though it's close. The intricate storytelling and character work connect with me more than the pure emotion of Atlantis-V3. Both should make my Top 50.
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Post by Cap on May 17, 2018 12:10:26 GMT -5
As of right now I think I am going Hart/Austin.
To me, Austin/Hart is the first or second best match in WWE history. I know it gets the overrated tag sometimes and I get that. I actually rewatched it leading up to Mania this year and loved it all the same. It is just intensity and drive from jump and two guys working in their primes to put on the best match possible. You get some creative leg work mixed in with the absolute hectic brawl they were having and on top of it all you actually watch them exicute the double turn in the ring (not on the mic, not in a segment.... in the ring) and I still value that a lot.
Vilano/Atlantis is a match that I completely understand the criticisms of as well, but to me it is all about context here. If two younger wrestleres went out and did the same thing it might eye rolly, but their experience and longevity matter. The gamble of the masks here is built upon their respective careers and it makes each near fall that much more valuable. Basically they had the capital to go all in on near falls and big moves and submission and clutter their way to high drama. Two younger wrestlers don't have that yet. Peresonally, I loved this when I watched it the first time. I do wonder how well this will hold up on rewatch, where I know Hart/Austin has shelf life.
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