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Walter
Jul 18, 2019 15:28:56 GMT -5
Post by Cap on Jul 18, 2019 15:28:56 GMT -5
For my money, no one has been better, match-to-match, than Walter over the past 3 years. He consistently puts out bangers and has been in my top 5 matches every year and been my #1 wrestler. Yet his best always winds up being just outside my list. Personally, i think his match with ZSJ from Pumpkin Spice Progress was the best he has done and I didn't consider it for the last list because I had to draw a line in the sand. I am going to consider it for the next list. He is also a guy who I worry about under the WWE umbrella because his matches have dipped a bit as he has worked towards adapting his style and evolving a bit.
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Walter
Jul 24, 2019 21:50:47 GMT -5
Post by bossrock on Jul 24, 2019 21:50:47 GMT -5
Was in my top 10 for 2017 and while I ultimately went with Omega for 2018, it really is a toss-up between the two for that year. The guy's floor is literally 3.5 stars. Tremendous powerhouse and striker. Can play the badass destroyer or the ultimate bully. Living proof that you don't need a ton of moves to have captivating or unique matches.
For best match, I think I'd go with either Thatcher at Progress Chapter 62, Darby at Evolve 106, or Ospreay at the OTT 4th Anniversary show. The Riddle series falls just outside those. With Thatcher, you had two tag team partners and "friends" who are both powerful and adept grapplers not holding back on punishing each other. With Darby and Ospreay, you had more David vs. Goliath matches with both having different approaches. With the former, it was the scrappy underdog. With the latter, it was the high-flier vs. the brawler. Just speaks to the guy's variety in matches.
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Walter
Jul 25, 2019 7:45:15 GMT -5
Post by Cap on Jul 25, 2019 7:45:15 GMT -5
I seriously considered the Thatcher match for my list. At one point it was #98. It didn't quite make it though. The Darby match is maybe my favorite match of his as it is just cathartic to watch the beating and the comeback. I love the Ospreay match, but I think the first Devlin match is the better OTT match. All the Riddle matches in Progress are great. I love the NYC one and was in the building for that .
For me, and I have been thinking about this a lot lately. I think the best Walter matches in my eyes don't match the consensus on him. Even one of my good friends who I often share a great deal in terms of tastes with is just not as hyped about the matches I see as Walter's best. The big examples for me are the Sabre title match I mentioned in the first post, the Fenix match from 16 Carat, and the recent Ilja title match in Progress. All of which I thought were amazing matches that exceeded some of his more hyped matches (which I also love). I am going to hold off on too much detail because I want to rewatch them back and really look for why I like them so much and then nominate them accordingly. The long and the short of it is I think they represent three of the best instances of Walter peaking in this ass kicker run but also blending with that this new selfishness that makes him a little more vulnerable and a little more dangerous all at once. I think in MOST cases there have been growing pains in Walter's shifting character and his acclimation to the WWE style, but in those matches things clicked beautifully to where he didn't look like a coward and didn't feel less like Walter. The Fenix match is a little bit of an outlier because the overall match wasn't quite on the level of the other two to me, but you had the amazing spots where Walter powerbombs Fenix's damn mask off and then Fenix gets a mask from the fans so he can keep wrestling, which to me was the coolest moment of the year in wrestling. Like I said, I will talk in more detail about these matches later when I nominate them, probably after I finish the forum work.
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Walter
Jul 25, 2019 20:30:18 GMT -5
Post by bossrock on Jul 25, 2019 20:30:18 GMT -5
I did like the Fenix match a ton as well. Very different match from a lot of the ones I've rated highly, but it's an excellent sprint.
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Walter
Aug 30, 2019 4:45:07 GMT -5
Post by elliott on Aug 30, 2019 4:45:07 GMT -5
Literally never seen him wrestle. Give me a top 10 to watch.
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Walter
Aug 30, 2019 7:43:03 GMT -5
Post by bossrock on Aug 30, 2019 7:43:03 GMT -5
vs. David Starr (wXw 16 Carat Gold 3/10/2017) vs. Matt Riddle (Progress Chapter 46 3/26/2017) vs. Matt Riddle (Progress Chapter 51 7/9/2017) vs. Matt Riddle (Progress New York City 8/12/2017) vs. Fred Yehi (Evolve 90 8/11/2017) vs. Matt Riddle and Timothy Thatcher (Progress Chapter 55 9/10/2017) vs. Timothy Thatcher (Progress Chapter 62 1/28/2018) vs. Ilja Dragunov vs. John "Bad Bones" Klinger (wXw 16 Carat Gold 3/10/2018) vs. Darby Allin (Evovle 106 6/23/2018) vs. Will Ospreay (OTT 4th Anniversary Show 10/13/2018)
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Walter
Aug 30, 2019 10:12:24 GMT -5
Post by Kadaveri on Aug 30, 2019 10:12:24 GMT -5
Here's a guide I once wrote for his 2018: The best independent wrestler in the world just debuted on NXT UK, so for those of you unfamiliar with WALTER I've put together a collection of tremendous work this beast of a man has been doing the past year. 01/28/18 - Walter vs. Timothy Thatcher - Progress Chapter 62. My rating - 4.5 Stars. Coming off a series of brutal matches with Matt Riddle in 2017 you'd be forgiven for thinking Walter had peaked in Progress, but oh no... just getting started. This match is incredibly violent, and it's all done with very basic wrestling moves. Almost shoot-style. Thatcher attempts to disable Walter's fearsome chops by destroying his hand, doesn't stop him getting chopped so hard his chest bleeds. Brutal fight. 02/23/18 - Walter vs. David Starr - Fight Club Pro. My rating - 4.5 Stars. Similar to last night, this was a surprise match as Walter's appearance wasn't advertised. Indie wrestling fans might be familiar with David Starr's quest to finally defeat Walter. They've fought across Europe and North America for years but he's never been able to beat him... until tonight perhaps. This is the best match of their series imo. Starr's selling is very good. I felt really sorry for him because beating Walter obviously means so much to him, he has to put himself through horrendous torment to try. Check out the shockingly vicious lariat from Walter in this. 03/10/18 - Walter vs. John Klinger vs. - WXW 16 Carat Gold. My rating - 4.25 Stars. Well I've spoiled this a bit but can't really help that... Walter won the right to challenge John Klinger for the WXW Unified Title AND he won the right to choose the stipulation of the match. Klinger is a total asshole and has a stable/army of goons called RISE who constantly interfere in his matches. Walter names his chosen stipulation. It's going to be a Triple Threat match, and the third man is none other than THE RETURNING.... You'll have to watch it for yourself. The match itself is non-stop fireworks, best triple threat of 2018. 04/06/18 - Walter vs. PCO - Joey Janela's Spring Break. My rating - 4.25 Stars. The most 'WTF!?' match of the year. Couldn't possibly list every moment of insanity in this match, but why would I want to. Pierre Carl Ouellet is in his 50s, and Walter comes down to the ring and tells him look dude I respect what you've done for this business, but it's time to step aside and asks him to forfeit the match. PCO responds by unleashing a full frontal assault with stuff chops + every flippy lucha move there is, and Walter barely even knows what's happening. Amazing. 06/23/18 - Walter vs. Darby Allin - Evolve 106. My rating - 4.5 Stars. Darby Allin's a cute little wrestler. He looks like a little gender-queer punk who wrestles when he's not getting into street fights with white supremacists. So I love that he wrestles exactly like that too. Crafty little underdog who knows he's gonna get the shit kicked out of him but is always ready to pounce on an opening to get a quick pin. Needless to say, Walter chops the hell out of him here and chucks his little body all over the place like a toy. 08/18/18 - Walter vs. Jordan Devlin - OTT Wrestlerama. My Rating - 4.75 Stars. This is my #3 Match Of The Year behind Almas vs. Gargano and Ishii vs. Omega. Firstly I'm so impressed by the quality of OTT's pre-match videos, whoever's doing them is really talented they're as good as WWE's. This match is really special as there's a red hot crowd solidly behind Devlin, who's the long-running Ace Champion of OTT and was undefeated for 22 months before being pinned by Walter in a tag match, so here he is redeeming the blemish on his record and defending the title and his whole promotion against this heartless invader. 09/30/18 - Tyler Bate vs. Walter - Progress Chapter 76. My rating - 4.5 Stars Walter is now the Progress World Champion and is defending on the biggest British indie wrestling show in 30 years. Tyler Bate has his BSS strong style buddies cheering him on at ringside. It's remarkable how a match mostly consisting of moves that wouldn't look out of place in the 1970s is getting the biggest reactions of the show and feels like a real big match showdown. Mostly revolving around tests of strength between Walter and his smaller but very strong opponent! Can't think of a prolonged headlock/sleeper spot in wrestling that got a bigger reaction in 2018. 10/13/18 - Walter vs. Will Ospreay - OTT 4th Anniversary. My rating - 4 Stars. Once again OTT kills it with their pre-match video. This is a much better version of their match on Defiant earlier this year where they seemed to have some awkward miscommunications. The contrast in styles sells itself and Ospreay does a commendable job in coming across as a competitive in such a heavyweight contest, even if it inevitably keeps ending in Walter swatting him out of the air. There's a bit of silly over-booking in this though that drags it down a bit for me so I've rated this lower than a lot of people (Meltzer had it at 4.75). 10/28/18 - Walter vs. Zack Sabre Junior - Progress 77. My rating - 4.25 Stars. These two are such fantastic and contrasting examples of the European indie style that's developed over the last decade. I'm sure their matches are going to be looked back on in years to come as historically important to the style. They've had so many great matches it's hard to pick just one so I'll go with the latest. They make it feel like such a rough fight in everything they do. You see Zack constantly trying to keep Walter as close as possible so he can't throw strikes, making everything really claustrophobic as they grapple trying to find openings for a submission or to pound their opponent as hard as they can.
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Walter
Aug 30, 2019 12:14:53 GMT -5
Post by Cap on Aug 30, 2019 12:14:53 GMT -5
I'd co-sign most of what was suggested here. There will be a lot of overlap here, but here are my rough draft top 10: 1. Walter vs Zack Sabre Jr (Progress - 10/28/2018) ****3/4I like this one a good bit more than most. I think the degree of difficulty here is really high. It is a real chess match. Strong work from both guys and they have great chemistry. I wouldn't start with this match. You probably should at least watch the other Sabre/Walter matches over the past few years because this builds on those. It doesn't jump off the page quite as much as some of his other high profile matches, but it is one of my favorites from him.
2. Walter vs Fenix (WXW - 3/9/2019) ****3/4 This match is relatively short, but full of awesomeness. The brutality of Walter, Fenix's athleticism and selling, mask rips, and holy shit moments that are either completely organic or are so well planned and exicuted that they seem that way. Walter is a little more hit or miss lately as he transitions into the WWE and becomes more full on heel in some ways, but this was a flash of the Walter of past.
3. Walter vs Darby Allin (Evolve - 6/23/2019) ****3/4 This is probably the match I would recommend Elliott to check out first. This is violence on violence on violence on violence. Walter getting to cut loose on bumping machine is absolutely phenomenal. Its an increadible clash of styles and sizes. tons of fun.
4. Walter vs Timothy Thatcher (Progress - 1/28/2018) ****3/4 Gritty, violence filled fight between two friends who will make you believe in them. This is another good starting point match. You will get to know Walter pretty well here.
5. Walter vs Daisuke Sekimoto (WXW - 3/3/2012) ****3/4 These two are made for one another in some ways. They just beat the ever loving shit out of one another. I really like this match. He has other gems from before 2017, but this one really stands out to me as the sign of things to come.
6. Walter vs Zack Sabre Jr. (PWG - 10/21/2017) ****3/4 I think most people prefer this to the aforementioned Progress ZSJ match. It is really violent and was one of the matches that really put Walter on a few more radars. I also think Big Dave gave this 5. Really intense, hot crowd..... good stuff.
7. Walter vs David Starr (WXW - 10/28/2017) ****3/4 Most people like the march match (also worth checking out) better than this, but I prefer this one. i think the limb work is a bit better here and they work a smarter match on the whole. In all though, outside of Sabre, Starr is Walter's best opponent and they more or less always have a great match. This just happens to be my personal favorite, but any of them would be worth checking out.
8. Walter vs Jordan Devlin (OTT - 8/18/2018) ****1/2 Excellent storytelling. Super hot crowd. Walter at his finest and Devlin showing out in front of the home crowd. This is just a wonderful wrestling match on the whole, maybe his most translatable match on the whole.
9. Walter vs Ilja Dragunov (WXW - 3/12/2017) ****1/2 If you like seeing people get hit really hard, you should watch this match. This tournament (this match and the Starr match particularly) helped raise Walter's stock, but it also made Ilja an indie star. I am not quite as high as some on it, but I still think its a phenomenal match. It might be a good intro to Walter as it is a very WALTER match.
10. Walter vs Matt Riddle (Progress - 8/12/2017) ****1/2
Walter and Riddle have had a bunch of great matches, quite a few in Progress. Once again, all of them very worth checking out. I like this one best. Its absolutely brutal and this crowd was super hot (literally and figuratively - this was the infamous NYC show that was super hot and people were passing out). Its wonderful
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Walter
Aug 30, 2019 15:24:09 GMT -5
Post by elliott on Aug 30, 2019 15:24:09 GMT -5
This is fantastic, guys. Thank you! Looking forward to checking him out. Literally I know two things: His name is Walter and he's a bigger guy. So going in pretty much blind.
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Walter
Aug 30, 2019 15:44:13 GMT -5
Post by nintendologic on Aug 30, 2019 15:44:13 GMT -5
His NXT UK match against Trent Seven is worth checking out as well. By far his best match in WWE. The Pete Dunne matches were pretty highly acclaimed, but they were far too evenly worked for my tastes.
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Walter
Aug 30, 2019 18:03:07 GMT -5
Post by bossrock on Aug 30, 2019 18:03:07 GMT -5
His NXT UK match against Trent Seven is worth checking out as well. By far his best match in WWE. The Pete Dunne matches were pretty highly acclaimed, but they were far too evenly worked for my tastes. Yeah, Pete working 50-50 with him as well as the length kinda hindered it for me.
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Walter
Sept 2, 2019 9:59:33 GMT -5
Post by kas on Sept 2, 2019 9:59:33 GMT -5
Pure consistency is WALTER's game, only matched by Will Ospreay in this day and age. Knows how to work the big man style almost perfectly and is fantastic at pacing his matches. On top of all this, he has possibly the best chops of all time. With all that said, with the exception of the Thatcher PROGRESS match and the Devlin OTT match, I'm not nearly as high on his big stuff as others seem to be. I've seen people put the Dragunov 16 Carat Gold match among their favourite of all time, and others call the ZSJ PWG match the best indie match of all time and I just don't see it. Funnily enough, I think the same thing of Ospreay.
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Walter
Sept 2, 2019 13:56:12 GMT -5
Post by bossrock on Sept 2, 2019 13:56:12 GMT -5
Pure consistency is WALTER's game, only matched by Will Ospreay in this day and age. Knows how to work the big man style almost perfectly and is fantastic at pacing his matches. On top of all this, he has possibly the best chops of all time. With all that said, with the exception of the Thatcher PROGRESS match and the Devlin OTT match, I'm not nearly as high on his big stuff as others seem to be. I've seen people put the Dragunov 16 Carat Gold match among their favourite of all time, and others call the ZSJ PWG match the best indie match of all time and I just don't see it. Funnily enough, I think the same thing of Ospreay. I'm sort of in the same boat with the Dragunov 16 Carat match as well. Great match, but definitely not in my top 5 for his best matches of 2017. I did like the Sabre PWG match a lot, but yeah definitely not best indie match ever or even PWG match. I didn't have him with any real MOTYC's in 2017 but he had 3 or so for me in 2018.
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Walter
Sept 2, 2019 17:58:24 GMT -5
Post by Cap on Sept 2, 2019 17:58:24 GMT -5
See I agree that his game is consistency, but I would put his best work a touch higher than yall I think. I mean I have my star ratings for his best matches above and I have 7 Walter matches at 4.75. That is a ton, even for me. However, I don't have any at 5 and non of his 4.75 made my list last year and none (so far) are making the list this year. The closest would be the Progress Sabre match, which I rewatched last week and still think is GREAT, but it isn't an all timer.
I think he has it in him, but the problem for him is doing something that stands out in terms of brutality. His matches are almost all brutal. I think he needs to hit a few different gears a little more often and keep a bit more in the chamber. In some ways WWE may eventually help with that. One of the things i think he needs to STRIKE (pun intended) a balance with is his chops. The reason I don't like the Ilja 16 carat match as much is really my biggest criticism of Walter's best work... sometimes he leans a little too heavy on the chops. He has a devastating lariat, john woo drop kick, powerbomb, and a couple of different kicks. He is at his best when he is using everything and sprinkles the chops in very strategically. This is why I really really liked the Dragunov match from a few Progress shows back. Its a 4.5-4.75er for me and when I watched it I thought it might be my match of the year (it since fell down the board a bit). Its not getting the hype that his normal matches do, but I thought the story was much more compelling and he was more varied and nuanced in his offense. That isn't to say he doesn't bring that a lot (he does), but it sometimes gets overshadowed by fans just wanting to see/hear him chop the shit out of people. Kadaveri also mentioned that Bate match from progress, which I loved and want to watch again at some point. That is another one where I think he used everything in his arsenal well and let the story work for him (i thought that was about 100 times better than Bate v Walter from this past weekend).
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Walter
Sept 2, 2019 18:43:53 GMT -5
Post by kas on Sept 2, 2019 18:43:53 GMT -5
See I agree that his game is consistency, but I would put his best work a touch higher than yall I think. I mean I have my star ratings for his best matches above and I have 7 Walter matches at 4.75. That is a ton, even for me. However, I don't have any at 5 and non of his 4.75 made my list last year and none (so far) are making the list this year. The closest would be the Progress Sabre match, which I rewatched last week and still think is GREAT, but it isn't an all timer. I think he has it in him, but the problem for him is doing something that stands out in terms of brutality. His matches are almost all brutal. I think he needs to hit a few different gears a little more often and keep a bit more in the chamber. In some ways WWE may eventually help with that. One of the things i think he needs to STRIKE (pun intended) a balance with is his chops. The reason I don't like the Ilja 16 carat match as much is really my biggest criticism of Walter's best work... sometimes he leans a little too heavy on the chops. He has a devastating lariat, john woo drop kick, powerbomb, and a couple of different kicks. He is at his best when he is using everything and sprinkles the chops in very strategically. This is why I really really liked the Dragunov match from a few Progress shows back. Its a 4.5-4.75er for me and when I watched it I thought it might be my match of the year (it since fell down the board a bit). Its not getting the hype that his normal matches do, but I thought the story was much more compelling and he was more varied and nuanced in his offense. That isn't to say he doesn't bring that a lot (he does), but it sometimes gets overshadowed by fans just wanting to see/hear him chop the shit out of people. Kadaveri also mentioned that Bate match from progress, which I loved and want to watch again at some point. That is another one where I think he used everything in his arsenal well and let the story work for him (i thought that was about 100 times better than Bate v Walter from this past weekend). I also think that he sometimes gives his opponent too much. This Bate match on the weekend, Bate did far too many power moves for someone who had his back destroyed throughout the match.
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