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Post by elliott on Dec 7, 2017 21:50:29 GMT -5
El Hijo del Santo vs La Parka (Super Llibre - Monterrey - 12/23/2001)
I love this and think it is one of the best brawls ever. Almost certainly one of the bloodiest matches ever. You almost can't believe it. Parka comes out in a white suit in this and ends up just covered in blood head to toe. This has always felt more like a fight than a wrestling match. Awesome stuff. Strong contender to make my list even if I put it in the 100 spot as a nod to a favorite. It is still worthy of making it on merit.
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Post by Cap on Dec 8, 2017 8:19:22 GMT -5
Second
I am looking forward to taking another look at this one. I watched it when I was on a big La Parka kick and this one sort of got positioned in my mind as just below elite, but it is still a match that sticks with me. I am a vampire so this obviously stands out to me in that regard. Both of these guys are all timers in my mind and they did seem to really click in this match for the most part.
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Post by KB8 on Jan 15, 2018 9:16:27 GMT -5
Yeah, incredible brawl. Santo hits an absolutely grotesque gusher and bleeds over EVERYTHING AND EVERYBODY. He topes Parka in the first caida and Parka rips like three rows of fixed seats clean off the ground. Parka going buck wild in the segunda was amazing, chucking Santo into the third row, ramming him head first into seats (Santo leaves a gigantic blood stain on one seat, like someone filled a water balloon with red paint and threw it at the seat), smashing the back of his head off the ring post, etc. In the tercera there's this moment where Parka winds up out on the floor, and every fan behind him scatters in case Santo topes him into their children's faces. This is Monterrey so I have no idea what is going on at the finish, but at this point I don't even count that as a part of the match in Monterrey.
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Post by bossrock on Jan 15, 2018 21:59:36 GMT -5
Third.
This type of match is right up Park's alley but Santo does a tremendous job as well. Loved how he just blitzes him early. Tons of blood, tons of violence, what's not to love? Probably the best match of 2001.
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Post by Cap on May 20, 2018 14:05:15 GMT -5
Rewatched this yesterday and it gets a pretty significant bump from me. It is a match that I can't help for dock for the finish because I don't know what is going on and it seemed generally unsatisfying given what we just witnessed. That says as much about me as the match but that just sort of something that cant be avoided. The thing I really like about this is how it sort of breaks convention in some ways. The beating Parka takes early on seems long, excessive. His comeback likewise. Nothing here seems like it is a matter of going through the motions, whereas even some of the best lucha brawls get that feeling with the falls. Of course the big, obvious story is the blood. Parka wearing the creepiest white suit and it slowly getting died pink was a sight to behold. This has a real shot at the back 1/2 of my list. I am going to probably put this up against some of the best lucha brawls when I am really crunching numbers.
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Post by elliott on May 20, 2018 21:20:47 GMT -5
Also just rewatched this and while I could see some criticisms (maybe goes on a little too long, Parka blows off Santo's early dominance, finish was weird) but I don't care, I loved it. I thought Santo was really amazing in this. The first part of this where Santo is in control is awesome with Santo just fucking laying into Parka with punches and kicks to the head. Some absolutely brutally stiff shots. And by "some" I mean like "thirty." It is nasty. I also thought his selling the beatdown and blood loss was great too. Watching this I kept thinking to myself "wait...is Santo just the best wrestler ever? Are we overthinking the obvious?"
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Post by Cap on May 21, 2018 7:23:11 GMT -5
I think this match raised an interesting question for me regarding wrestling I watch out of its cultural context. With wrestling this isn't often a huge deal, but sometimes - particularly when I am watching Lucha - I find myself just not getting stuff, esp around finishes. Even when I look it up and and find some explanation, it just doesn't resonate with me. This is a prime case study. A wonky ending can really take me out of something and here is this other worldly, violent match with a strange ending and I am sort of left wondering.
So i guess there are actually maybe two questions I should bring to discussions: one about context and one about finishes.
Edit: Yeah, I pretty much think Santo is on the short list. He is in the top tier of guys I think will have the most representation on my list. There are luchadors I "like" more, but i am not sure there is one I could in good conscious rate higher than him in a greatest of all time list. I know Casas gets that love a lot (and I really love Casas), but to me the only one I would probably seriously consider would be Satanico maybe. If someone told me that Santo was easily the greatest wrestler ever I wouldn't bat an eye. His output is on another level. He has as many or more 5 star matches on my list as anyone. He might only be outdone by Hansen in that regard for me.
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Post by bossrock on Jun 8, 2018 8:37:38 GMT -5
Re-watched this and it's gonna be tough to not make the list. The match is merely "good" during the first fall while Santo beats down Park but really takes off to "next-level great" when Park turns the tide in the second fall. It seemed a bit strange how much more heated the match got when Park began to mount his comeback, but it works in a way. Santo, as good as he is, isn't as good a brawler as Park and it's made evident during the second fall when Park basically says "Pssh, amateur! THIS is how you fight!" The amount of blood loss from Santo is insane and it absolutely works. The third fall becomes much more of a back-and-forth bombfest that any fan of WWE and NJPW epics would enjoy. The ending is definitely a black eye on this terrific match, but it's still arguably one of the 100 greatest of all-time.
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Post by mvz on Oct 16, 2021 20:45:57 GMT -5
Man Santo is great in this match, great variety of offense all delivered at a high level, conveying emotion and exhaustion, and of course the blood. Loved La Parka’s work in the second fall. Obviously a better finish is needed but this was a great intense brawl.
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Post by KB8 on Jun 21, 2023 15:52:52 GMT -5
I bumped this off my list a few days ago because I couldn't remember much about it. Thankfully I came to my senses and watched it again because boyyyyyy this is one of the all-time great lucha brawls. I said this yesterday when talking about Santo/Brazo, but for a guy we associate with graceful dives and gorgeous wrestling sequences, the son of El Santo is a fucking animal when it comes to brawling. He went at Parka with a vengeance in that first fall, just a relentless force and wouldn't let up. The way he then blended the beauty with the savagery with that tope was absolutely top drawer. Parka ripping rows of fixed seats off the ground with his body didn't hurt either. It was a total domination of an opening fall and Santo's viciousness was something to behold. After his comeback Parka maybe could've sprinkled in a little more selling of the beatdown he'd just received, at least in the early stages, but you forget that as soon as he starts yeeting Santo face-first into rows of seats. Santo's gusher is a horror of a thing and BLEEDS EVERYWHERE and leaves literal trails of blood wherever he goes. He got hung upside down in the corner at one point and that part of the ring looked like a murder scene. Parka ramming the back of Santo's head into the ring post is legitimately one of the nasties post shots I've ever seen. Where Santo is on an island almost of his own is the way he sells blood loss in the third fall. He was incredible here putting across the toll of what he'd sustained, even how he'd climb the turnbuckles like that in itself was an arduous process. Of course the dives were spectacular and there are very few things more lucha libre than spectators fleeing for their lives, scrambling to remove their children from harm's way, praying for the elderly in the front row too slow or frail to withdraw, as a wrestler ends up in front of them as another wrestler runs the opposite ropes. And all of those people were right to retreat, because Santo fucking obliterated Parka with that tope. I had no memory of what the actual finish was even though I knew it was something ropey, so I was preparing myself for it. To be honest though, I didn't think this was even in the top two or three tiers of horse shit Monterrey finishes. Santo needing to just be RID of Parka and volleying him in the balls was a hell of a spot on its own, at least. I'm not sure this cracks my top 50, but it should land around that 60-70 range.
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Post by midwesternlariart on Nov 27, 2023 17:59:48 GMT -5
Old school lucha brawls are something I connect to more than I do old school lucha title style matches. It's the same problem I have with a lot of more exhibition-y mat based work elsewhere, except I haven't really patched the gaps it takes to remove yourself from watching more tight work in Japan and Europe vs the looser stuff you see in llave. Narrative, tied with violence, is the element of wrestling I'm most attracted to. That's why this really worked for me.
Santo reels me in here with his performance on a few different levels. I was pretty uninterested during the back half of the primera because this is pretty one note from Santo jumping Parka on, even extended to the first half of the segunda. Santo's work on top isn't like all time work or anything, but it's solid and necessitates the really great transition to La Parka's big comeback and furthers this really incredible double turn, I think? Again, new here. As Parka begins to grab a second wind escaping from the camel clutch, Santo drills him with a beautiful dive before slipping up and missing a follow up crossbody and La Parka BRUTALIZES him for it. Santo walks into the third fall having spent the rest of the segunda getting massacred and bloodied (more on this later) with this profoundly human moment on the ground, resting on the bottom rope. Santo just felt the weight of karmic justice to a hellish degree and I think that lends this moment a weight of empathy. When someone makes a rash decision for an understandable reason, you connect with it. It's that trope about justified villains, it even connects with the monterrey crowd as they back Santo coming into the 3rd fall. What makes this whole thing so incredibly pro wrestling is that, when once again faced with a very close, desperate contest against La Parka, Santo doesn't learn his lesson. He cheats with corrupt referees and low blows in the last half of the 3rd fall and almost gets away with it, until the good referee catches him and gives the last fall to Parka, causing Santo to FINALLY snap completely. I'm not really sure still if this is a heel turn, but if it is, it's one of the best ones in history.
Not to discount Parka's role here either. Parka's definitely playing it down for the story and the angle, but Parka's desperate and violent comeback in the second fall is insane and violent as hell. He busts Santo open at some point while launching Santo into the monterrey crowd or more likely, when Parka pins him down on the outside and unloads on his skull with a bucket like 6 or 7 times in one of the best revenge spots ever. Seared into your brain type spot. As good as Santo is, it doesn't work half as well without Parka seeking such an incredible amount of vengeance.
The last point I have for this review is maybe the most obvious: the blood. the sheer amount of blood Santo's blood that soaks the entire ring, ringside area, and La Parka's body suit. It is so insane how much poor out of his head in quick succession. It's maybe not like peak BJW deathmatch level of blood, but it's about the most I've seen to come out of mexico. I'm sure there's more, but I've yet to see it.
This maybe has all the tools to get to a top 100 GME. It for sure has the story, I just wish that it had gotten there much sooner because then, we'd be talking about this one a lot more. ****1/2
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