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Post by Cap on Mar 28, 2018 20:35:54 GMT -5
I want to start a few comparison threads to put styles, matches, wrestlers, etc. side by side as a way of making sense of the project.
I am starting with what might be my favorite styles of wrestling, the brawl. Instead of picking out two "types" I wanted to instead leave this thread open to any type/time period/region when it brawl, allowing people to compare and contrast as they see fit. Brawls are almost universal so maybe we will need to whittle it down later, but for now, I wanted to keep it open.
What is your take on brawls?
What is your favorite type, time period, or region when it comes to brawls?
What brawls will rank highly for you and why?
What are the strengths of a brawl?
What makes a good brawl and who/when did it best?
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Post by stunninggrover on Mar 29, 2018 19:15:14 GMT -5
I want to start a few comparison threads to put styles, matches, wrestlers, etc. side by side as a way of making sense of the project. I am starting with what might be my favorite styles of wrestling, the brawl. Instead of picking out two "types" I wanted to instead leave this thread open to any type/time period/region when it brawl, allowing people to compare and contrast as they see fit. Brawls are almost universal so maybe we will need to whittle it down later, but for now, I wanted to keep it open. What is your take on brawls? What is your favorite type, time period, or region when it comes to brawls? What brawls will rank highly for you and why? What are the strengths of a brawl? What makes a good brawl and who/when did it best?
I love brawls. Some of my all-time favourite matches are brawls.
Lucha brawls are tremendous. I also tend to enjoy brawls involving Terry Funk. Some of the joshi puroresu brawls have been great too (especially the ones in the 1990s featuring Bull Nakano). I think most of my all-time favourite brawls are from the 1980s and 1990s.
Sangre Chicana vs. MS-1 is not only my highest ranked brawl, but also my current #1 Greatest Match Ever. To me, that match is the pinnacle of pro wrestling. Brawling, blood, violence, the feeling of a true war, a fight till the end where both men give everything they have.
Akira Hokuto vs. Shinobu Kandori from AJW Dream Slam I will rank really high.
Terry Funk vs. Jerry Lawler from 3/23/1981 and 4/6/1981 will rank very high. Terry Funk is just amazing in those matches and Lawler was great too. Wild and crazy action. Lots of intensity.
Strengths of a brawl... it shows that pro wrestling matches can be like a war. Something that will leave the viewer with some great memorable moments.
Sangre Chicana, Terry Funk, Stan Hansen, Bull Nakano and Jerry Lawler come to mind as some of the very best brawlers ever.
When there is blood and chaos, there's a big chance a brawl will end up being a good brawl at the very least.
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Post by elliott on Apr 2, 2018 1:04:24 GMT -5
Answering Cap's questions one at a time What is your take on brawls? Brawls are the best! They are the style most able to really transcend wrestling and feel like events or something greater than the sport itself. What is your favorite type, time period, or region when it comes to brawls? 80s Puerto Rico, Lucha, and Memphis are probably my big 3. But if something is described as a "great brawl" from any time period or region, I'm more likely to give it a shot than if it was described as a "title match." What brawls will rank highly for you and why? Realistically, I will probably have like 75-80 matches on my list that could be described as brawls when it comes down to it. Chicana vs MS-1/Perro, Invader 1 vs Perez/Starr, El Dandy vs Satanico x2, War Games, Dump vs Chiggy x2, Funks vs Sheik & Abby x4, Hokuto/Kandori, Hansen/Andre, Kudo/Toyoda, Magnum/Tully, Funk vs Hansen x2, Lawler vs Funk x2, Lawler vs Dundee x3, Dustin/Buck, and literally dozens of matches I'm forgetting that aren't just locks for my list, but I could see all of that shit and more making my Top 50. Brawls are the best. What are the strengths of a brawl? Ability to transcend the genre of wrestling. Stuff like Funk/Onita or Lawler/Funk or Hokuto/Kandori is so cinematic and I think title matches aren't really able to achieve that sort of thing. Who am I kidding? Violence and blood.  But really, I think brawls "travel easier." Johnny Valentine vs Wild Bull Curry looks a lot closer to a modern day brawl than Dory Jr vs Antonio Inoki looks like a a modern day title match. Thats sort of what I mean. The great brawls are always going to be timeless. Whenever you see threads where people ask to suggest old school matches to show a casual fan, I think the best ones to pick are things like Hansen vs Andre or Funk vs Lawler. Brawls are always going to translate. What makes a good brawl and who/when did it best? In a word: Chaos. I can say things like selling, psychology timing, hope spots, transitions, etc etc. And yeah, of course, all of that is true. You kind of want selling, psychology, etc in all matches. I could say blood and violence but there are bloody and violent brawls that aren't good brawls. I guess the common trait I can think of that I love about my favorite brawls is that they are all bring a feeling of chaos. In terms of who did it best: Terry Funk, Stan Hansen, Invader 1, Sangre Chicana and Jerry Lawler were the first 5 names to come to mind. When I think the word "brawl" I see in my mind's eye Funk and Hansen rolling around on the ground trying to murder each other. |
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Post by joeg on Apr 2, 2018 3:09:27 GMT -5
What makes a good brawl is the chaos and the violence. What makes an all time great brawl is the heat segments for the heel and the come back for the babyface. My all time favorite brawls all have that in common- the heel gets rediculous amounts of heat with weapons, cheating, dirty tactics and blood galore and the babyface fires up and comes back. The Hansen vs Colon bullrope match or the Sheik and Abby vs Funks or any big Onita spectalce, thats what seperates them. Its not the violence, but how the violence is used. You can watch some of the crazier promotions out there and they put on some of the most violent, un-nearving brawls I've ever seen but the crowd doesn't react because there is no heat just guys cutting each other up with weapons and beating the piss out of each other.
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Post by microstatistics on Apr 3, 2018 23:59:01 GMT -5
Note: I'm only talking about pure, minimalist brawls here. So no LCO matches, Hokuto/Kandori, Kudo/Combat, Valentine/Piper or other classic matches that have brawling aspects but aren't strictly brawls, IMO. What is your take on brawls? I guess I'm significantly lower on brawls than most people in the PWO circle. For me it's extremely difficult to construct a brawl that is a great match, with the exception of a handful of bouts. The formulaic nature hurts them but I think one of the main aspects of brawls, the chaos and the wild feel, actually works against them more often than not, as it comes off as haphazard and structure seems like a mess. Chaos can still be coherent and proceed in a logical manner but it takes to a truly great brawler to manage that. What is your favorite type, time period, or region when it comes to brawls? Lucha and Memphis. Puerto Rico is good too. What brawls will rank highly for you and why? Satanico vs. Chicana 5/26/1989, Lawler vs. Dundee 12/30/1985 Amazing selling, great character work, logical progression, great build + escalation + pacing, beautiful strikes. Minimalist classics. What makes a good brawl and who/when did it best? El Satanico and Jerry Lawler are top 2. Sangre Chicana, Sgt. Slaughter, Pirata Morgan, Terry Funk, Carlos Colon are other great brawlers. |
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Post by bossrock on Apr 11, 2018 9:32:11 GMT -5
What is your take on brawls?-Love brawls. There's nothing like a good, violent fist fight. It's wrestling at it's most visceral. I enjoy big offensive displays, but there's something special about just watching two guys beat the crap out of each other and not run the ropes.
What is your favorite type, time period, or region when it comes to brawls?-I don't think I have a particularly favorite style, time period, or region. It's usually a "I'll know it when I see it" situation. As long as the action is frequent and relentless I'll have a good time.
What brawls will rank highly for you and why?
-Satanico vs. Dandy (hair vs. hair): My favorite brawl ever and is at least a top 10 contender for best match ever. The stakes are high and the hatred is evident. It's competed at a breakneck pace throughout and the violence never lets up.
-Lawler vs. Funk (No DQ): Very realistic, feels like you're watching an actual shoot. Both guys are hitting each other with absolute bombs and Lawler's comeback is great.
-Funk vs. Hansen (1982): The sense of chaos is palpable. One of the best atmospheres in wrestling history.
-DiBiase vs. Duggan (Loser Leaves Town): A crazy set of stipulations but comes together perfectly as the two just bloody each other beyond recognition.
-Funk vs. Flair (Great American Bash): Flair is taken out of his comfort zone and yet still rises to the occasion against the unpredictable and deranged Funk. Like Funk-Hansen, just a very real feeling of chaos and "anything can happen".
-Anything with Colon-Hansen: Probably the greatest series of brawls ever. These two are just relentless with Hansen using every dirty trick in the book and Colon making the most firey babyface comebacks I've ever seen.
What are the strengths of a brawl?-It's the best way to end a blood feud. You finally get to a point where neither competitor can stand each other and will do everything in their power to kill their opponent. They're also usually high stakes situations, such as a Loser Leaves Town or Hair vs. Hair match. Immediately adds that sense of desperation and urgency to an already volatile situation.
What makes a good brawl and who/when did it best?-In all honesty, blood is huge for brawls. Blood is the most visible indicator of the intensity of the match. In regards to who did it best, Hansen to me was always the best brawler. He could create that sense of chaos and unpredictability in virtually any match situation. Nothing was sacred to him because he was a malicious, no-good bastard. He would make a fight as dirty and vicious as possible and he gelled with practically everyone he did it with. That's the mark of a great brawler. Funk was also great at creating that sense of chaos and gelling with a ton of opponents. Could play the unsinkable babyface or the psychotic heel with ease. Carlos Colon was perhaps the greatest babyface brawler and Satanico was arguably the best lucha brawler. And while I'm not quite as high on Lawler as some folks, he was still a tremendous babyface.
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