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Post by Cap on Dec 10, 2017 15:31:47 GMT -5
Katsuyori Shibata vs Kazuchika Okada (IWGP Heavyweight Championship - NJPW - 4/9/2017)
This match might be somewhat controversial because of what happened to Shibata, but I think it is easily one of the best matches of the year (outside of the headbutt). I strongly prefer it to the (in)famous 6 star classic between Omega and Okada. I just think this is a really compelling blend between Shibata's strong style and Okada's more traditional wrestling style. They make those two speak to each other really well. One of 2-3 matches I am considering for my match of the year in 2017.
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Post by fadu on Jan 4, 2018 17:47:25 GMT -5
I think Shibata's performance vs Chris Hero in 2016 might be the most impressive performance of Shibata's career as he married all his machisimo tropes into being quite an endearing babyface there. However, here Shibata's performance made him seem like the most badass wrestler who ever lived. The shot of blood and sweat mixing on a closeup of his face after "the headbutt" will forever be imprinted in my mind. Shibata is so compelling as a machine that will never stop charging forward I feel he kinda makes Okada feel out of his league. Obviously, it wouldn't have worked with the aftermath of the match, but it's hard to not say Shibata shouldn't have won this match and carried the company in Okada's stead. He felt that big of a star from this performance.
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Post by tetsujin on Jan 4, 2018 20:58:30 GMT -5
Absolute YES. Not only my undisputed 2017 MOTY, this is also a #1 contender for me. Yeah, #1 contender. Both men performances are so over the top from start to finish... Today, it's on my top 5 ever. I'm just in love with it.
Am I the third one?
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Post by joeg on Jan 5, 2018 4:11:43 GMT -5
It will be on my list. 2017 was a really good year match wise, and this was by far my favorite match from the year. Okada's white meat babyface selling when Shibata is this badass shooter who never stops coming forward. Its really one of the best selling performances of all time by Okada. He sold exhaustion and he sold being knocked silly beautifully.
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Post by bossrock on Jan 5, 2018 15:47:15 GMT -5
While this was only a top 10 contender from 2017 for me, there's a good chance it makes the list. It really is arguably the best performance of Shibata's career and one of Okada's best as well. Excellent story of Okada trying to play Shibata's game only to fail, thus forcing him to rely on his bread-and-butter. But when Shibata manages to withstand everything Okada throws at him, he again lets his pride get the better of him. Shibata is at his most violent and resilient, absolutely pounding away at Okada while working over the arm to weaken the Rainmaker. I can see a lot of people leaving this match off due to Shibata's injury and I completely get it. But as a match, this is a NJPW all-timer.
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Post by fxnj on Jan 5, 2018 23:16:43 GMT -5
This isn't going anywhere near my list. I remember trying to sit down 4 or 5 times to watch this and was always turned off by the beginning before I finally sat down determined to watch the whole thing. The MMA matwork is just awful with Shibata lazily running through some positioning work and Okada looking like he has no idea what's going on. Rest of the first half isn't much better with them just hitting their moves without it really feeling like it's of consequence. They do some arm work that goes nowhere and sit in some submissions for way too long without it really meaning anything, which is one of my least favorite things. They also run through some strike exchanges which felt forced as hell just so they could get in all the worst aspects of modern long matches. Match gets good for the stretch run, though it really just into a bomb throwing match with the cheesy handholding rainmaker motif like a lot of Okada matches end up. I have to admit it made me uncomfortable seeing them continue after headbutt as I had always assumed that to have been the finish and Shibata seems pretty miserable right now as a result of his injury, but even without that I doubt I'd think much of this. One of the most overrated NJPW matches in a year of overrated NJPW matches.
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Post by fadu on Jan 7, 2018 13:18:20 GMT -5
I get the early mat work complaint. Okada doesn't really seem credible as a "master of all" ace. He should be mince meat in most grappling and strike exchanges.
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Post by Kadaveri on Jan 7, 2018 15:54:27 GMT -5
This will probably be on my list and I have it at 4.75 stars. I greatly enjoyed the opening segment of the match and I saw Okada 'not knowing what's going on' and him just being dominated by Shibata, who isn't even trying his best. The whole match is Shibata just outwrestling and outstriking Okada in every exchange as like psychological warfare to break his spirit. In a year where I felt NJPW had a bad habit of overly long main-events this was the one match that I felt warranted this amount of time to tell that story.
This would be a 5 for me if it had a better finish. The biggest narrative of the match was that Shibata had outsmarted Okada like no one had ever done and rendered his rainmaker arm useless. I feel that at that point either 1. Shibata wins or 2. Okada thinks of something Shibata never prepared for to win. Having Okada win by just powering up and giving him a few more rainmakers was flat.
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Post by bossrock on Feb 1, 2018 20:51:01 GMT -5
Just re-watched this and it will absolutely make my list. Again, Shibata's injury makes this a tough watch. But this was still an absolutely incredible match and fantastic performance by both men.
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Post by dkuchler31096 on Feb 13, 2018 21:54:56 GMT -5
This match is everything I love about pro wrestling. There was an intensity about this that is rarely met in a pro wrestling ring. While it was a tragic end to a career, it was also poetic how he went out.
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Post by Cap on Aug 12, 2019 20:16:39 GMT -5
Inspired somewhat by the insane pop Shibata got recently at the G1 final, I really want to revisit this match. It wound up #2 on my MOTY list for 2017, but it was RAZOR thin. I haven't watched it since and want to see how it holds up after a little time.
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Post by Cap on Oct 28, 2019 20:29:56 GMT -5
from my watching project... Katsuyori Shibata vs Kazuchika Okada (IWGP HW Title – 4/9/2017) Current Rank: 56 Trending: Even I have always gone back and forth on this match. For the longest time I didn’t even have it as the best match of the year (Trevor Lee vs Chip Day was my pick for ’17 – I still think its closer than most). However, when I submitted my list this year this was one of the final three bubble matches that didn’t get to rewatch. So, I made it a priority to give it another look before turning in a second list. I have probably watched it 4-5 times now. It’s one of those that that kept drawing me back. It wasn’t so much the hype, but me feeling like there was something in the match that was going to eventually click and push this match over the hump. That finally happened here. This is – along with Black Terry vs Wotan – one of the only two matches I think are in the race for match of the decade for me. It is just pure, pro wrestling goodness that gets a steroid injection of gravitas with the headbutt and the subsequent fallout. So, I might as well address the elephant in the room. I have discussed this before, so I won’t harp too much on it, but I personally don’t have much problem with praising and celebrating matches that go over the line – intentionally or otherwise – of good sense and safety. It isn’t always my thing and it doesn’t make something automatically great to me, but if the match is good and the wrestlers’ sacrifice and dedication adds to my investment in the match, I don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater. In turn, while I hope we never see a dude end his own career (potentially) with a headbutt, I think it added an affective element to this match that is really hard to deny. I would be hard pressed to believe someone who said they were floored by that sound and the look on Shibata’s face as blood trickled down his face. While I really like Okada and think he is genuinely a gifted wrestler, this is the Shibata show to me. He brings his hyper strong style into the match with a more traditional wrestler and adjust beautifully. The match is violent but nuanced. It elevates both men. Even more so than the Okada/Tanahashi matches, this feels like an epic clash of greats in the same way much of the 90s AJPW feels that way, just the tension and electricity around the match and how they never lose that throughout. For now, this match is probably going to hover around middle of the pack for me. I think we need probably 5-10 years before we really know how great a match was and who knows if this project will still be going by then, but this feels about right somewhere in the middle 1/3rd of a list like this for me. Full Post: gweproject.freeforums.net/thread/657/caps-watching-project-reports?page=2#ixzz63hbfBudS
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Post by kas on Jan 25, 2020 10:16:38 GMT -5
On a re-watch, this is a number one contender. While Shibata dominated, I feel Okada got in enough offence to make his victory a lot more believable than something like the Suzuki match in February, and that the somewhat abrupt finish fit in with the overall story of Okada having to capitalise on Shibata's smallest mistakes. I do think Okada was tremendous here, but Shibata absolutely stole the show with his offence, his intensity, his selling, and several of those subtleties that make Shibata stand out as a wrestler.
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Post by bossrock on Jan 25, 2020 14:50:15 GMT -5
While Shibata dominated, I feel Okada got in enough offence to make his victory a lot more believable than something like the Suzuki match in February, and that the somewhat abrupt finish fit in with the overall story of Okada having to capitalise on Shibata's smallest mistakes. Yep. Shibata got so wrapped up in beating Okada up that he couldn't finish the job, allowing Okada to grab the wrist.
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Post by violentbydesign on Aug 30, 2021 2:13:14 GMT -5
At first watch I thought this was the best New Japan match I ever saw.
Second watch, the middle aspects of the match is kind of lost - at one point I thought maybe I was even watching the wrong match lol. I think because the only thing I really remembered about the match was the headbutt, and that didn't come for a long time.
I did a rewatch of the Omega and Okada stuff, and I have to say this was better than all that. And it's better than all the AJ Styles stuff I've seen in New Japan as well.
So it wasn't quite as good on rewatch, but it's probably still going to be the best New Japan match I've seen (I still have to watch and re-watch a lot though, including this years stuff which I haven't seen).
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