|
Post by tetsujin on Jan 19, 2021 9:40:26 GMT -5
Looking at the 2016 results, I'm kinda worried about most of the 80s U.S. wrestlers there. I mean, Flair, Funk and Lawler in a lesser degree, all three will still be #1 contenders, but I don't know if guys like Bockwinkel, Rose, Steamboat, Savage, Whindham, Anderson, Blanchard, Dundee, Murdoch, DiBiase etc will place as high as last time. Idk why, but I feel like having the 00s and possibly even the 10s in bigger consideration this time might go against most of the 80s workers.
|
|
|
Post by elliott on Jan 19, 2021 11:00:50 GMT -5
You guys have an interesting definition of lucha if Eddie Guerrero and Rey Mysterio aren't considered luchadores. Let's not pretend Eddy and Rey Jr are equivalent to Satanico and Emilio Charles Jr because they all got their start in Mexico. Dont be silly.
|
|
|
Post by nintendologic on Jan 19, 2021 11:50:28 GMT -5
You guys have an interesting definition of lucha if Eddie Guerrero and Rey Mysterio aren't considered luchadores. Let's not pretend Eddy and Rey Jr are equivalent to Satanico and Emilio Charles Jr because they all got their start in Mexico. Dont be silly.
Equivalent in what way?
|
|
|
Post by elliott on Jan 19, 2021 12:11:12 GMT -5
You understand the differences between luchadores Eddy Guerrero and Rey Mysterio Jr vs luchadores El Satanico and Negro Casas.
|
|
|
Post by elliott on Jan 19, 2021 12:17:37 GMT -5
Looking at the 2016 results, I'm kinda worried about most of the 80s U.S. wrestlers there. I mean, Flair, Funk and Lawler in a lesser degree, all three will still be #1 contenders, but I don't know if guys like Bockwinkel, Rose, Steamboat, Savage, Whindham, Anderson, Blanchard, Dundee, Murdoch, DiBiase etc will place as high as last time. Idk why, but I feel like having the 00s and possibly even the 10s in bigger consideration this time might go against most of the 80s workers. I think this is definitely the case. Being so far removed from the DVDVR 80s projects definitely hurts those guys because there isn't as much focused discussion. I don't know that it would hurt Savage or Dibiase as much as someone like Jerry Blackwell or Tito Santana. I think the Crockett super workers like Arn and Eaton or the late 80s early 90s WWF era folks like Hennig or Rude will always have people supporting them.
|
|
|
Post by Cap on Jan 19, 2021 13:07:24 GMT -5
I think if I ever participate in something like this I'm going to have to feel ok doing so without my watching habits fundamentally changing. I found the prospects of watching in the way that many who took part last time did completely overwhelming. We got lots of long exhaustive cases for wrestlers and I suspect the discourse that made it seem like that was an unspoken expectation was either A. more in my head than in reality or B. exaggerated generally. I was thinking about it today and I feel probably 10 times more confident in what would be my list than I would have 5 years ago and I'd still probably feel under-qualified.
All I know is that if Kandori doesn't finish better than 146 (actually not bad) next time I'm going to lose it. I'll be dropping elbows on my jacket and everything.
|
|
|
Post by nintendologic on Jan 19, 2021 13:56:50 GMT -5
Eddy and Rey were both trained in Mexico, spent the formative years of their careers in Mexico, and main evented for the biggest promotions in Mexico. That makes them clearly luchadores in my book the same way Billy Robinson was clearly a British wrestler even though he likely spent far more time in the US and Japan.
|
|
|
Post by elliott on Jan 19, 2021 14:05:02 GMT -5
You understand the differences between luchadores Eddy Guerrero and Rey Mysterio Jr vs luchadores El Satanico and Negro Casas.
|
|
|
Post by elliott on Jan 19, 2021 14:07:31 GMT -5
Its pretty obvious when people complained about the lack of and placement of Luchadores on the final list, they were referring to folks who spent the majority of their careers in Mexico based promotions.
|
|
|
Post by microstatistics on Jan 19, 2021 23:09:28 GMT -5
Yeah I agree with elliott. When I think lucha (or luchadores), I think of Mexican promotions and wrestlers (e.g. CMLL or Satanico, Santo etc.). Eddie and Rey are American.
My 2016 ballot was utter garbage (though the experience was informative), so I wouldn't mind if we did one here. Either Top 50 or 100 is fine.
|
|
|
Post by elliott on Jan 19, 2021 23:56:16 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Cap on Jan 20, 2021 7:24:35 GMT -5
Aren't there people putting a smaller 2021 project together already spinning off PWO? I'd be down to submit a list of either 50 or 100, depending on timing and perimeters.
Edit: just checked PWO again. I'm still not sure I understand what is happening for a 2021 project, but it seems about as informal as we are discussing. If we wanted to house a side project here to submit some lists and share (beyond what we already have in the previously mentioned thread) I think that could be fun. If someone wants to head that up let me know and I can make a little subsection of the forum and/or give admin to anyone who would need it for that.
|
|
|
Post by witlon on Jan 20, 2021 9:31:55 GMT -5
Looking at the 2016 results, I'm kinda worried about most of the 80s U.S. wrestlers there. I mean, Flair, Funk and Lawler in a lesser degree, all three will still be #1 contenders, but I don't know if guys like Bockwinkel, Rose, Steamboat, Savage, Whindham, Anderson, Blanchard, Dundee, Murdoch, DiBiase etc will place as high as last time. Idk why, but I feel like having the 00s and possibly even the 10s in bigger consideration this time might go against most of the 80s workers. I think that leads to a bigger question, too. Most have noted that Lucha wasn't highly represented in the 2016 list, but where do the guys fall off to make room for even the Lucha guys? We only had 19 people (Including lucha) that weren't males from the 70s to 00s US or Japan, by my count, so there has to be some give somewhere to make room for more, and some obvious 80s Joshi choices that people now have time to get to, as well. I'm interested to see where the 'give' is, on the list to make room for the different candidates this time around.
|
|
|
Post by elliott on Jan 20, 2021 11:29:47 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Cap on Jan 20, 2021 11:54:35 GMT -5
|
|